WEDNESDAY 13/02/02 16:44:32

Adams on united Ireland

Republicans must persuade unionists that their interests would be better served in a united Ireland than they currently are in the United Kingdom, Sinn Fein president Gerry Adams argued tonight

On 13/02/02 16:52:40, Eoin Money said:

I find this magnanimous attitude quite surprising. It all sounds very nice, but I'd be happy with a 50% plus 1 vote for a united Ireland and a tough luck for unionists just like they treated Nationalists. After all Unionists maintain they are true democrats and surely all would respect any majority vote for Irish unity. You are democrats aren't you ?

On 13/02/02 16:55:19, Andrew from Yorkshire  said:

What they (Unionists) mean by 'their sense of Britishness', Gerry' is that they will NOT live in an all-Ireland state. That is what makes them Unionists. My ancestors fought to keep Northern Ireland in the UK and the onus is on the present day pro-Union populace to ensure that the basic constitutional question remains unadulterated. They certainly don't need to be antagonised by Mr Adams and his electoral hogwash.

On 13/02/02 17:09:39, Peter from Dublin said:

It is good to see Gerry Adams being so magnanimous but will Republicans practise what they're preaching about respecting Unionist culture. What Sinn Fein should be doing is focussing on governing Northern Ireland for the mean time and cool off the speeches of Irish unity because we all know its not going to happen in the short term

On 13/02/02 17:17:10, Tell it like it is! said:

It does not matter what you think Andrew you are not from the Island of Ireland and will have no say in its future for that I am glad because you are a moron!! Gerry is right everyone would be better off on both sides, come out of the dark ages Andrew and know that you state that your ancestors terrorised and raped our country I can see how you have became such a bigot!

On 13/02/02 17:22:11, Siobhan Cooney from Dublin  said:

Not only do we want the Unionists as part of a United Ireland - we need them! They appear to be the perfect ying to our Southern yang. I hope they seriously consider the position they could be in after Unification, some pundits are suggesting they would have 20% of the seats in what is now Dail Eireann but with Southern Conservatism (don't laugh, there is such a thing you know!) in desperate need of a credible party to join they could enjoy huge support and power and while I'm here can we have the current Regional Development Minister Peter Robinson MLA as First Minister of All-Ireland?? I believe he is the best Minister in Ireland North or South of the border (principled politicians is only a dream in Dublin)and with Mary Harney as his deputy (ok we do have one) we might sort this island out finally... Andrew in Yorkshire, don't you have ANYTHING constructive to say EVER?? Leave us to sort ourselves out..aren't there any Yorkshire websites that you could grace with your comments?

On 13/02/02 17:28:32, Civic Unionist from Manchester said:

Poor old Gerry - he's clutching at straws isn't he? Of course he conveniently fails to mention that in addition to a vasy majority of Protestants, a significant number of Catholics (maybe even a majority) are quite happy for N. Ireland to remain within the UK. After all you can celebrate your 'Irishness' within the UK - isn't that what being part of a pluralist state is all about? What is more likely is that the Republic will continue its present drift towards closer economic and political union with the UK. We live in a post-nationalist era - accept it.

On 13/02/02 17:38:23, Mickey From Free Derry said:

That is just a typical response from Andrew there.....his sense of "Britishness", his "identity" and "being".... is nothing more than being anti-Irish or anything remotely Irish at all.Your arguments and reasoning are extremely hollow to put it mildly.

On 13/02/02 17:52:23, RB to One Money from Belfast said:

Mr One Money- we fear no referndum in fact we openly encourage it as unionists. Any recent surveys (latest 1999 QUB Social Attiutdes Survey) found only 21% suppport for unity within Northern Ireland) and with the demographics for young children taking a recent swing in favour of protestants it certainly holds no fear for me. Also you may spout about "tough luck" but unionists could also say nationalists never respected the pro British majority before so why should we accept it in the unlikely event of a pro unity majority.

On 13/02/02 18:03:26, Willie said:

Ignore Andrew - he is a professional agitator. Gerry Adams is correct. Nationalists have nothing against Unionists in spite of the gross human rights violations and the years of discrimination. A new day has dawned. Soon there will be no question - votes with be there for a United Ireland. Nationalists want to include Unionists - that's what the orange and the green mean in the flag. We are all from the same place, and the same blood. Let's compromise our way to peace and opportunity for all.

On 13/02/02 18:05:13, to "tell it like it is" said:

Hey, go easy on wee Andrew. We don't want him to stop contributing his bigoted nonsense as he just makes himself a bigger fool each time he posts a message. Andrew,old son, if I were you ( and thank God I'm not ) I'd just stick to issues in your own locality eg why don't you have a wee whinge about all the flooding over there rather than have perpetual "digs" at the Irish? Where does your venom come from eh? Were you bullied at school? Are you still cheesed off at losing the rugby grand slam at the hands of Ireland last year? Whatever is making you gripe, it just clearly indicates a man with high blood pressure and definitely not at peace with himself.

On 13/02/02 18:31:22, gareth Hunt from Ballymoney Co.Antrim said:

Gerry Adams is a liar.....republicans have murdered 2000 people in Northern Ireland.Today they still wont let them have their culture they attack orange men and children when they walk or even on their buses,they burn their churches and community halls.Is he having a laugh here saying they would be better off in a sinn fein all ireland.

TOP

On 13/02/02 18:51:51, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

Once again I repeat -what is the prospect of a vote for a so-called united Ireland? Very little. I cannot understand the mentality of a people who are prepared to see the economic, social and political destabilisation of a country in pursuit of a constitutional objective. Oh, and by the way, 'tell it like it is', I'm very glad I'm me - a good living Christian rather than a fawning acolyte of an IRA apologist. Northern Ireland is part of my country and I will continue to 'grace' this website with my opinions of those cretins who seek to destroy it. I'm sorry that you republicans can't handle that but I guess it's your sense of immaturity.

TOP

On 13/02/02 18:55:33, ExPat from Boston, USA said:

If the criticisms aimed at Andrew are anything to go by, is anyone surprised that unionists will treat Adams' comments with a large degree of skepticism? Oh I forgot, anyone from outside NI should not make comments on NI, unless they're in agreement with IRA/ Sinn Fein. So much for parity of esteem!

TOP

On 13/02/02 19:28:17, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

I've just checked my blood pressure - it's 120/80 which is normal. Blood pressure tends to rise under tension or as a result of a guilt complex. I wonder how many nationalists suffer from increased blood pressure as they walk away from the polling station on election day - knowing full well that they endorsed a party linked to an organisation that was responsible for 60%+ of all the deaths throughout the troubles?

TOP

On 13/02/02 19:44:07, Paddy Carlos from said:

As an Irishman I would like to see everyone living in peace and prosperity on the island. But when push comes to shove, at least 20% of the nationalists in NI will not vote for a United Ireland. As important as Gerry thinks his party is, he's forgetting about the Me Fein party (myself alone). Why would a Catholic who has a nice paying civil service job vote to alter the status quo and see his job moved to Dublin. Also there would be a fairly large swing in the South against a UI, especially if there was a prospect of civil mayhem breaking out. The people in the South are peace loving and while the state might have been founded in bloodshed, there is no stomach for that kind of nonsense now. On a positive note - Unionists have nothing to fear from a UI, but we don't need bigots like Gerry telling us how it should be done. This is a man who wants the murderers of Irish gardai released from prison. The horse you rode in on Gerry.

TOP

On 13/02/02 19:45:06, AH from Enniskillen said:

A "united ireland"? The possibilities just don't exist.

TOP

On 13/02/02 23:36:32, Paul from Belfast said:

OK Gerry, lets show just what Unionists can expect in this new Ireland starting with letting them walk the Garvaghy Road unhindered, in a spirit of inclusivness. (Didn't think so!!)

TOP

On 14/02/02 00:55:06, Ballysillan Loyalist from North Belfast said:

These comments from Gerry Adams is a joke.Republicans cant accept Loyalists as part of this country now so why should Loyalists believe they would be accepted in a United Ireland?Its just what the Sinn fein/PIRA president Gerry Adams does best say nothing but lies.

TOP

On 14/02/02 01:59:43, ed from usa said:

nothing new here,,,,,,,,,,,same old line,,,,,,,,need new blood

TOP

On 14/02/02 05:45:52, to rb from said:

I guess you are reading the wrong stats! Acording to University collage LONDON there will be a catholic majority in N.I. with in 30 years. Two main reasons, firstly as long as loyalist thugs stop killing catholics the average yearly death rate amoung protestants is twice that of catholics,and when it comes to children, 50.66% of children under the age 16 are indeed catholic! Better start learning Irish! Slan

On 14/02/02 09:16:47, Belfast man from said:

I would like to encourage Andrew to keep making postings- after all as a fellow citizen of this United Kingodm he has every right to comment on his countrymen. Anyway to Gerry Adams, thanks for the offer but the pro British Majority will stay exactly that- part of a diverse, multi cultural pluralist UK. You can keep your mono religious, mono cultural united ireland, but hey, thanks for the offer and the patronising concern.

TOP

On 14/02/02 09:27:35, Martin from said:

Andrew, you clearly are not a 'good living Christian'. It wasn't so long ago that you suggested that sectarian violence against Catholics in Larne was a comeuppance for alleged republican attacks on Protestants in other parts. You are a hate-filled bigot - end of story.

TOP

On 14/02/02 09:47:03, Long term from Randalstown, Co.Antrim said:

Why do people not think through what will happen if a UI ever happens. Do you honestly think, Loyalist Paramilitaries would stop killing, if anything they would become the "IRA", on a so-called justified campaign based on the fact that NI was once part of the UK. And what about the social/economic aspects of a united Ireland, i wouldnt want a UI just to have my taxes raised significantly. I think the best NI can hope for is status as a independent state outside of UK, but unfortunately our economy is subsidised by UK to much and we would be crippled in the short term. The unforunate thing about NI is you cant please everybody, and unlike most other countries when disagreement happens people get murdered. The sad thing I dont think it will ever get better!

TOP

On 14/02/02 10:11:23, lisa from n.ireland said:

I fully respect Andrews concern but from an oposing viewpoint I feel that as a democratic nation the views of the majority of people should rule; that being the majority of the entire island. I feel that it is democratically unfair that in northern ireland it is often forgotten that we naturally belong with the rest of the island, and i as a young person feel that change is now needed so that the majority of us on the entire island who support reunification will be listened to as i totally agree with Mr Adams.

TOP

On 14/02/02 10:49:16, RB to Lisa from Belfast said:

As a young person I must say your views are very naive. Firstly most people, including Mr Adams, supported the GFA which provided that no change would occur to NI without a majority in NI appproving it- so its a bit late now. In addition you seem to associate nationality in terms of an island- Republicans try to define nationality by a land mass, clearly a childish way of looking at things. Throughout the world we can see countless examples of major land masses that have separate countries even though they share the same land mass- eg Portugal / Spain; US/Canada; Sweden/Norway etc- the list is too long. If we look for the smaller land masses we can again see how ridiculous the republican idea of nationality is- the island of New Guinea divided into Papa New Guinea & Indonesia (Java); Borneo / Malaysia; Haiti / Dominican Republic etc.

TOP

On 14/02/02 11:50:11, Concerned from Belfast said:

I have just finished reading all the comments on Gerry Adam's call for a UI. I am slightly concerned at the low level of tolerance towards each other that seems to exist with in our community. I believe that they are a far greater number of questions that need to be addressed in the short term (umemployment, welfare, street violence) and that these fundamental issues to daily living seemed to be overshadowed by a concentration on wider issues. Anyway I believe that whether we live in a UI or as part of the UK we MUST live together and respect each other.

TOP

On 14/02/02 12:13:41, The Badger from said:

Don't kid yourselves..a catholic majority will not mean a united Ireland. As before Ireland will be repartitioned in order to reinstate a Unionist majority.

TOP

On 14/02/02 12:51:27, Seany from said:

There seems to be many in the unionist community frantically clutching at straws - dismissing the statistics on demographic changes and trying to convince anyone who will listen that catholics will not vote for a united Ireland, even though 98% of the catholic electorate vote for nationalist parties. Simply putting your heads in the sand, trying to bring down the political institutions and targeting innocent catholics in an attempt to reignite the war will not stop the change that is coming

TOP

On 14/02/02 13:10:37, Tell it like it is! from said:

All this economic mayhem is a joke! Forward thinking here people the EU will be running everything by that stage at current rates with one currency and legal priority. If the change was to come it would as much of Britain passing the buck of NI over to the EU as it would be a majority vote.

TOP

On 14/02/02 13:14:53, mickey From Free Derry from said:

To RB.Your remarks highlight your ignorance.Nationalists & Republiccans do not define Nationality by landmass at all.....the fact is that Ireland was artificially partitioned against the wishes of the majority of the nation....in 1921 what gave Protestants, who were only 1/4 of the population, to artificially create another statelet within another country? the people of the Island of Ireland have a moral & legal right to re-Unification of the Island.Ireland was a single unified country until recent history....and we quite correclty,want our country back. Efforts towards that goal will only grow stronger as the tide of history is on our side.

On 14/02/02 13:23:24, J-Lo from said:

waste of time even discussing this. Fairytale idea.

TOP

On 14/02/02 13:53:11, the bloke from boston said:

blow us up one day and love us the next does commander adams really think we would trust him stop eating the mushrooms adams this is the real world

TOP

On 14/02/02 17:04:48, Jim Carson from Stranraer said:

To add to RB's excellent post i'd like to ask lisa what her opinion is of the people who live on the various islands surrounding Ireland. Would the people of Rathlin get a vote or are they distinct from the Irish, since they live on a different island? What about the good folks of Aran and Achill islands respectively? Would they all live in independent states under your islands=nations theory?

TOP

On 14/02/02 17:09:39, Give it a go from said:

A united Ireland is a great idea. Bomb and kill for 80 years like nationalists did to Northern Ireland. Let's see if Dublin can afford bills running into the billions when the IFSC goes up.

TOP

On 14/02/02 20:11:36, Unionist from CO .ANTRIM said:

Dream on gerry.

TOP

On 14/02/02 22:09:39, Fra from the falls from said:

Why should Gerry Adams not talk about an united Ireland? He is simply doing his job as a representative of the Nationalist community - that's why we voted him in. Are we not in a time when these things can be discussed in a civilized fashion, or would Unionists prefare republicans to go back to speaking through violence? I prefer the former rather than the latter.

TOP

On 14/02/02 23:35:23, Puzzled from said:

What a great history teacher mickey from free derry would make. When exactly except under British rule was Ireland ever united, or am I mistaken about the kingdoms of Munster Leinster Ulster etc.

TOP

On 15/02/02 10:12:18, Mickey From Free Derry from said:

To puzzled....typical unionist non-sensical response! be obtuse if you so choose to be...but the fact of the matter remains that Ireland was illegally and immorally partitioned in 1921 against teh wishes of teh majority of teh population.Facts speak for themselves....i hope history is not always this perplexing for you...????

TOP

On 15/02/02 11:28:44, Chris from Banbridge said:

Responding to Civic Unionist from Manchester, Nationalists can't celebrate their Irishness under British rule and Unionist control as they can' even get funds for a St. Patricks day celebration in Belfast.

TOP

On 15/02/02 11:34:18, pussy from Co Down said:

NEVER, NEVER ,NEVER ADAMS. The republic doesnt want you or your likes. Where wpould your mate Maskey get his FREE MOBILITY CAR? They can't afford us. We have a better standard of living, we don't pay for our G.P. consultations, prescriptions, dental care etc. need I go further? There in NO CHANCE OF a UI. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER. WHERE DID YOU HEAR THAT BEFORE? We hav not gone away either????

On 15/02/02 12:29:16, Meryvn from said:

The only reason Gerry Adams is saying these ridiculous statements is because he is trying to fool his republican voters into a false sense of security. We all know the IRA had a ceasefire in the first place and that was because the loyalists were killing too many catholics. I am not afraid to say that this will happen again if there is a United Ireland whether it be democractic or not.

TOP

On 15/02/02 12:35:28, GER to Pussy from said:

"NEVER, NEVER ,NEVER ADAMS...There in NO CHANCE OF a UI. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER." Ah Yes, another great example of the unionist political strategy - when confronted by change revert to what you know best (never, Not an Inch, No Surrender..etc..etc.) Unfortunately mate you will have to come up with something a bit more constructive than this. The political and demographic tide is turning towards the reunification of Ireland, if you have an opinion on this and want to influence developments then blindy screaming NEVER is going to accomplish nothing. This is the current policy of the DUP/UDA - trying to turn the clock back, trying to destroy the peace process and trying to reignite the war by targeting catholics. Unfortunately for them it will not strengthen the union one bit.

TOP

On 15/02/02 14:37:06, Rab to Mickey from Carrickfergus- still loyal and free said:

Mickey- sneering at people does not become you- particularly when you are ignorant of the facts. Ireland was partitioned with the explicit signed agreement of the elected govt of the south you idiot. You may be free Mickey, but that mental institution must have large grounds.

TOP

On 15/02/02 14:45:03, Mickey from Derry. from said:

Well mervyn....when there is a United Ireland..which should be sooner rather than later.....we shall see what happens.I think alot of Protestants especially the clergy want a United Ireland.Small minded guys like yourself are blinded by FEAR.Your main problem is FEAR.I am not afraid to say that Loyalist extremists will be wiped out by the Brits before Ireland is re-unified.Your "great" bigotted forefather said so himself.."the last fight will be between Unionism and Britain"....well mervyn...judging by the last decade and even before....that looks like where your heading! your last fight will not be with Irishmen...it will be with the Brits.

TOP

On 15/02/02 15:04:06, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

Oh dear! It looks as if GER and others have fallen for the old demographic nonsense again. Is this really the limit of your (nationalist) vision - 'we couldn't make the Unionist people bend their knees towards a united Ireland by bombing them so we'll outbreed them instead'. This has to be the most ludicrous argument for political change I have ever come across. There is no demographic timebomb!!! The NI Catholic birthrate is falling faster than anywhere else in the EU and (why I have to keep repeating this to make you understand is beyond me) there is only a small chance of a Catholic majority emerging. Despite the growth in the religious demographic total the majority in favour of the Union is remarkably durable and constant. Please, if only for your own sakes, stop proselytising yourselves into believing that the Union is dead. This is clearly not the case and was not the case even before the Belfast Agreement was signed.

TOP

On 15/02/02 15:19:59, Carlos Santana from said:

I have a suggestion to improve communication on this site. For each article there should be a poll with 3 options: "1: I am a loyalist bigot who hates nationalists/republicans and all they stand for", "2: I am a republican bigot who hates all they stand for", "3: I can see the argument of both sides but wish they would both just wise up". Then UTV can just display counters showing the result. That way we could get the same information as we get in these diatribes in a much neater, easier to read format.

TOP

On 15/02/02 15:21:44, Mickey from Derry from said:

To Rab....that "signed agreement" you refer to was not the WILL OF THE PEOPLE...and was signed under duress.Furthermore the boundary commission was defunct from the moment it was set up! thereby making the whole sham of the partition treaty huge white elephant! in otherwords...THE TERMS OF THE TREATY WERE NOT HONOURED...you simpleton!ps. How's Free Carrickfergus these days?? still free from Imperialism?

TOP

On 15/02/02 17:09:44, Rab to Mickey from Carrickfergus (Free from republican fascism) said:

Ahh good to see the Grimm Fairy Tales Republican version of Irish history is alive and well in Michael's house. Carrick is indeed free- me and my mates- both catholic and protestant will be going to the match against Linfield tomorrow and enjoying a few pints along the way. It truly is a free town- unlike the no go zone of Londonderry town centre for protestants.

TOP

On 15/02/02 17:56:06, Mickey from Free Derry from said:

Well Andrew....for your information...there are no commentators anywhere....no statisticians anywhere....no politicains anywhere that are of the opinion that, by any stretch of the imagination, the Union is strong...in fact they argue quite the opposite ...and then of course there's You....keep on talkin' and keep on deluding yourself...unless you're of the opinion that everybody else is wrong and you are right...surely not???? ..then again..isn't that what all great delusionists do?

TOP

On 15/02/02 17:59:45, mickey From Derry. from said:

Well Rab...I wonder if your "Catholic"(aye right!) mates read your postings on this site.You prove yourself to be nothing more than a bigot...I'm sure your mates then would also refer to my home town as Free Derry...would they not???

On 15/02/02 18:06:55, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

Sorry Mickey - but I never used the terms 'strong' or 'weak'. The Union throughout all the UK has changed irreparably because of devolution. What I said was that the Union is not dead; there is no demographic timebomb and only an outside chance that the current constitutional status quo would be changed by popular will. I'm afraid the only delusionists on this site are people like yourself who have been conned by your Sinn Fein heroes into believing that their involvement in a partitionist constitutional settlement somehow advances revolutionary Irish republicanism.

TOP

On 15/02/02 23:55:10, Rab to Mickey from Loyalist Carrickfergus- (very free) said:

MY catholic mates of which there are several describe your town as Derry/Londonderry- indeed they are free from the fascist yolk that dictates what name they should call a town. In Carrick they truly are free, and I shall enjoy a pint with them in a few hours.What they can accept is that a protestant is an equal unlike you in your squalid mono religious mono cultural towm centre.

TOP

On 16/02/02 03:51:15, Willie from said:

Mickey from Derry I have to hand it to you. I have no patience for these Loyalist bigots. You are to be commended.

TOP

On 16/02/02 18:52:07, rambo from said:

NO WAY WE WONT HAVE HOME RULE, WE WONT BE TRODDEN UNDER BY REPUBLICANS WHO WANT TO FORCE THEIR VIEWS APON US!

TOP

On 16/02/02 23:30:17, SHONA O'NIELL from ARMAGH said:

I THINK THAT NORTHERN IRELAND IS BETTER OFF BEING PART OF THE UK!! THERE ARE A LOT OF CATHOLICS THAT DO NOT WANT A UNITED IRELAND AND THERE ARE OTHERS THAT DO NOT CARE. I AM ONE THAT DOES NOT CARE AS LONG AS THE VIOLENCE OVER THE PAST 31 YEARS COMES TO AN END AND WE ALL CAN LIVE TOGETHER.

TOP

On 17/02/02 00:17:09, Nick from England said:

I'm British, Protestant, but not ignorant, having studied Irish history at school, I know that a united Ireland is the only way forward. However, people who are full of hatred and despise other religions are not Christian - ever heard of 'Love thy neighbour?' Anyway, why don't we all work towards a united Europe - would that not be good?!!!

TOP

On 17/02/02 00:22:39, Nick from England said:

i posted something here before but it was too short and i didn't have time to explain my views. if you would like me to, hint hint andrew, please contact me: [email protected] - i'm open-minded, so would love to hear yours!

TOP

On 17/02/02 16:19:09, Richard from Wexford said:

Interesting stuff. My own view is that we need to go for joint authority until the population swings to 75% one way or the other. I consider myself a nationalist and would love to see a UI but it is absolutely unrealistic at 50:50. Mind you it would be a good laugh to see the FCA attempt security duty in Larne.

TOP

On 18/02/02 10:55:01, GER to Andrew from said:

That's right mate - the census is telling us lies, the commentators who study demograhic trends have got it wrong and only you can see their mistakes. By the way do you really think that nationalists are following a policy of outbreeding unionists?? Your life may be that sad but we do the wild thing for the sheer fun of it. You should try to get out more Andrew I fear you have spent to long by your computer with your mouse in your hand. I'm sure there's a whole host of Yorkshire lasses just dying to meet you.

TOP

On 18/02/02 11:37:17, RB to Richard from Wexford said:

Some interesting thoughts Richard, however I would add the following- The religious breakdown should not be overemphasised or assumed to follow national allegiance lines. The most recent surveys on the constitutional position (NI Social Attitudes Survey 1994 & QUB Survey 1999) found only 25% & 21% support respectively for a united ireland within Northern Ireland. Clearly a sizeable number of catholics would appear to favour a pro UK stance.

On 18/02/02 11:57:01, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

GER, what census is this you are referring to? The figures for the 2001 census do not appear until December. The only reliable data comes from the Continuous Household Survey, whose most recent figures give a breakdown of 42% RC, 54% P, 4% others. So I think it is you who is living in a dreamworld. By the way, as far as my dating habits are concerned, I would opt for a relationship with a troll convered in warts and varicose veins before I would date an Irish nationalist.

TOP

On 18/02/02 12:10:00, GER to RB from said:

"Clearly a sizeable number of catholics would appear to favour a pro UK stance." That's strange when 98% of the catholic electorate vote for nationalist parties committed to a united Ireland

TOP

On 18/02/02 12:10:23, mickey From FREE Derry. from said:

Yeah right RB....that's why 44% of the population of the 6 counties, and 98% of Catholics, vote for the 2 Nationalist/Unification parties...the SDLP and Sinn Fein. This is the only poll that matters...i think oyur arithmatic is a few hundred thousand out!

TOP

On 18/02/02 14:32:05, RB to Both Ger & Mickey from Belfast said:

You both fall into the trap of extrapolating votes for SDLP and Sinn Fein with a vote for a united ireland- clearly this is nonsense when a question PURELY on the constitutional issue is given. Certainly it is safe to say most Sinn Fein voters would back a united ireland- but there are a sizeable amount of catholics who vote for SDLP, Alliance etc who are quite happy with the UK status quo. By the way my arithmetic skills (or lack of) are not the issue- both surveys were carried out by independent bodies using accepted survey methods (which gives an error of roughly 2% either side). There are many reasons why people vote for parties- one of the main being the personalities involved- you are foolish in the extreme to assume an outcome on the consitutional issue based on SF/SDLP votes. In addition, in overwhelmingly unionist areas such as East ANtrim and North Down the turnout for normal elections is barely half that of traditionally more nationalist areas- in any major consitutional referendum I think it is fair to say the turnout would be very different indeed (if one wishes to work on preumptions which you both appear to).

TOP

On 18/02/02 15:30:15, GER to Andrew from said:

The figures from the 2001 Census have been compiled and are awaiting publication later in the year. Many of the findings are already in the public domain here. Indeed Spotlight, a local politics programme, devoted a whole programme to the Census findings last week. Its a shame you are not better informed - it may spare you from making a fool of yourself. Incidentally regarding your assertion "I would opt for a relationship with a troll convered in warts and varicose veins before I would date an Irish nationalist". Who suggested you should date an Irish girl?? Yopu really are a bitter little man Andrew.

TOP

On 18/02/02 16:40:18, portadown observer from said:

its a bit presumtious of you to think that all the catholics who vote for sdlp and sien feinn vote on the one issue of united ireland , surely they cant all be that narrow minded??

TOP

On 18/02/02 18:41:52, SK from Dublin said:

I've known for a while that when it comes to reasonable, logical arguments, Unionism has always been left wanting, but I have to say that before this little debate I had no idea how much trouble the myopic fools are in. Its either "NEVER, NEVER ,NEVER ADAMS...There in NO CHANCE OF a UI. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER." or threats that catholics will be killed in their droves in a democratic United Ireland. Is that all they've got? The Unionist oppressors of the Seventies have become today's paramilitaries, lashing out against the flourishing of nationalism and their own lost dominion, and even though they can feel their evil little foothold slipping away, they wont accept the inevitable and make life easy on everyone concerned. A united Ireland is coming. We know it, the Americans know it, even the British you claim your loyalty know it, so why all the resistance? Please, accept the obvious and at least try to think outside the little orange box while you still have some dignity left. We would all be better off in a United Ireland, all Irishmen, Orange or Green.

TOP

On 19/02/02 02:26:15, Multicultural Mucksavage from said:

ABC News in US (one of the most credible) say they got inside information that shows Catholic population at 47% from current census. This number will be released later this year. As regards a United Ireland, there's obviously a lot of Catholics who right now would not vote for a UI, but if the Unionists such as DUP continue to be intransigent and against Dublin involvement in Assembly, against All Ireland bodies, etc, how long before they say enough and vote tribally. It really won't take much to change their minds. The fact is it's going to be 50/50 very soon and it's time for everyone to work together. Both are going to have to give up something - Unionists will have to be prepared for a dillution of the Union and Nationalists for something much less than a UI. Maybe joint authority. Win win surely.

TOP

On 19/02/02 04:33:30, David McMaster from said:

Mr Adams would be better of starting with the more immediate task of uniting the people of Northern Ireland, before tackling the greater task of a Uniting the Island of Ireland, unless he has a desire to see a mirroring of the "troubles" from the other community. I would suggest that this is wholly unachievable with the empty promises and insincere rhetoric that seems aimed to impress Media audiences worldwide, but only serves to further alienate his "cause" from the people he most needs to influence if he has any hope of reaching his goal. This paradoxical approach to the “Irish problem” leaves most unionists wondering what his true intentions really are, for when all is said and done he isn’t going to have to live next door to the people he so desperately seems to want to impress.

TOP

On 19/02/02 04:57:42, to andrew from said:

Obviously you have not read the latest report from university college LONDON, from imformation gathered from the census, catholics are at least 45% of the population, protestants are dying at a rate of twice that of catholics and finally currently enrolled in school, 50.66% of children under the age of 16 ar indeed catholic, your fact are wrong! As for the other loyalist whiner, I am so glad you know what is in our minds, it is very reassuring! Oh andrew don't forget to kiss your troll good night!

On 19/02/02 10:04:49, GER to RB from said:

Your assertion that a vbote for the SDLP is not a vote in favour of a United Ireland is without basis. The SDLP, from its grass-roots to its leadership has always maintained it is committed to achieving a united Ireland, as recently as last week Mark Durkan made this point in an interview. In fact they have been even more eager to assert their nationalist credentials since Sinn Fein overtook them in the last elections. Of course we cannot say they everyone who votes for them wants a united Ireland - but then we could say the same about those who vote for unionist parties couldn't we.

TOP

On 19/02/02 10:15:22, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

There is no information from the Census - inside, outside or in My Lady's Chamber. The only reliable current figures come from the Continuous Household Survey 2001 and they are as follows: Roman Catholic 42%, Protestant 54%, Other/None 4%. Check these figures out bey contacting the NIO and asking for the section that deals with that report if you don't believe me.

TOP

On 19/02/02 11:10:39, to andrew from said:

so pathetic, just because you say it does not make it so, it's time for you to open your eyes, read the truth and accept it. Dont forget you have absolutely no say in the future of Northern Ireland, yorkshire people will not be asked to participate in the decision, sorry your opion means absolutely NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!

TOP

On 19/02/02 11:45:08, RB to Ger from Belfast said:

I think we in a funny way we might just agree in the sense that the continued nationalist chants of "united ireland just being round the corner" is based on presumption. Again you could say the same about my thoughts on the matter (the two surveys notwithstanding) however in support of my confidence I look forward and actively encourage a border referendum ASAP to show the strength of the union- at the end of the day that is the only true test- not votes for individual parties because there are varying factors why people vote for people, parties etc.

TOP

On 19/02/02 12:03:14, Steve from Bangor said:

Here is a link to a more recent poll (http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2000/Political_Attitudes/NIRELAND.html)- from the independent surveys carried out in conjunction with Queens Uni Belfast. This one is from the Year 2000, and shows 60% in favour of remaining with UK- 17% in favour of Irish unity- 9% in favour of independence and 14% others. Clearly one can see the folly of assuming a 51% catholic figure would automatically follow a 51% vote for a united ireland.

TOP

On 19/02/02 12:41:46, Mickey from Free Derry from said:

To Steve from Bangor....simply put..what utter rubbish!!!..i mean you Loyalists dismiss OFFICIAL ELECTION figures but champion various opinion POLLS..based upon hearsay! by their very definition, opinion polls are not based on ACTUALITY..but nothing more than hearsay! Loyalists..wake up and smell the Easter Lillies!

TOP

On 19/02/02 13:36:04, GER to RB from said:

Yes I think we can actually agree that in the absence of a borderr poll none of us can claim to know the true extent of support for the union or a united Ireland

TOP

On 19/02/02 15:22:23, Andrew from Yorkshire said:

Quite right, Steve. The obstcles to a unified republican utopia are, I would argue, insurmountable. That's why the collective IRA-loving cretins bleat their opprobrium the way they do.